Comments on: A Summary of the New Perspective on Paul http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/ Just another Marketing WordPress Legion site Mon, 30 Jan 2012 02:32:43 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Jeremy Einfeld http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-322 Jeremy Einfeld Mon, 09 Jan 2012 20:38:57 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-322 Alfiesaden, The Paul page has recently changed to a new server, it could be that FireFox still has the old location saved or cached in some way. If you hit Ctrl+Shift+Del, you can clear out the "Cache" option and see if it brings you to the current location of ThePaulPage.com. If that doesn't work you can try clearing the cookies as well, but afterwards you will have to log into other sites that you visit. Alfiesaden,

The Paul page has recently changed to a new server, it could be that FireFox still has the old location saved or cached in some way. If you hit Ctrl+Shift+Del, you can clear out the “Cache” option and see if it brings you to the current location of ThePaulPage.com. If that doesn’t work you can try clearing the cookies as well, but afterwards you will have to log into other sites that you visit.

]]> By: alfiesaden http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-265 alfiesaden Wed, 04 Jan 2012 11:09:47 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-265 hi - is it just me !! can any one explain why when i type in the firefox browser "www.thepaulpage.com" i get a different site yet whe i type it in google its ok? could this be a bug in my system or is any one else having same probs ? alf hi – is it just me !! can any one explain why when i type in the firefox browser “www.thepaulpage.com” i get a different site yet whe i type it in google its ok? could this be a bug in my system or is any one else having same probs ?
alf

]]> By: God of Israel and Christian Theology: Wrap up | A Thinking Reed http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-67 God of Israel and Christian Theology: Wrap up | A Thinking Reed Wed, 05 Oct 2011 20:56:54 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-67 [...] relationship between Jews and Gentiles. (Although, if I’m not mistaken, some of themes of the “new perspective” on Paul seem like they might provide support to this kind of [...] [...] relationship between Jews and Gentiles. (Although, if I’m not mistaken, some of themes of the “new perspective” on Paul seem like they might provide support to this kind of [...]

]]> By: Go to Hell, Gandhi! | leadme.org http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-66 Go to Hell, Gandhi! | leadme.org Wed, 23 Mar 2011 16:19:17 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-66 [...] a major transformation via the groundbreaking work of N. T. Wright and other scholars of the New Perspective on Paul (actually, a recovery of the original pre-Roman, pre-Reformation perspective), which may end up [...] [...] a major transformation via the groundbreaking work of N. T. Wright and other scholars of the New Perspective on Paul (actually, a recovery of the original pre-Roman, pre-Reformation perspective), which may end up [...]

]]> By: Vijay Tagore http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-65 Vijay Tagore Wed, 23 Feb 2011 16:26:31 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-65 I have no comments on the article as such but just a real question to all of us who support the NPP - ask yourself deep down in your heart and observe the people around you - can you really maintain your standing before God if it were not for Christ's sake? I think NPP is such a waste of time and a challange to the deep roots of Christianity. Remember, Satan can use even our intellect and academic achievments to defame Christ's name and His work on our behalf. The Bible is no debtor to any man's support to prove its teachings. It is God's Word - crystal clear! I have no comments on the article as such but just a real question to all of us who support the NPP – ask yourself deep down in your heart and observe the people around you – can you really maintain your standing before God if it were not for Christ’s sake?

I think NPP is such a waste of time and a challange to the deep roots of Christianity. Remember, Satan can use even our intellect and academic achievments to defame Christ’s name and His work on our behalf.

The Bible is no debtor to any man’s support to prove its teachings. It is God’s Word – crystal clear!

]]> By: Jason McNutt http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-64 Jason McNutt Thu, 10 Feb 2011 15:50:33 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-64 Justin, I agree with your point but I am more concerned in this conversation that convenant mediation (which I believe is taught in the Bible) is being promoted exclusively at the expense of substitution. The OT clearly has both a mediator as well as substitution language which Christ fulfills. It is not one or the other but both and much more. Substitution is not a foreign concept to Jews or a western invention. Justin,

I agree with your point but I am more concerned in this conversation that convenant mediation (which I believe is taught in the Bible) is being promoted exclusively at the expense of substitution. The OT clearly has both a mediator as well as substitution language which Christ fulfills. It is not one or the other but both and much more. Substitution is not a foreign concept to Jews or a western invention.

]]> By: John http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-63 John Fri, 04 Feb 2011 00:21:12 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-63 Hi Justin, Paul's gentile Christians were being beguiled by judaizing interlopers. Paul responded by insisting his work and preaching consonant with the Cross, and by insisting with at least equal force that the judaizing agitators were not. The issue is not first century Judaism, and the intricacies to be found between its factions. The issue is between Judaism, as it was presented by the Judaizers, and the "Judaism" many moderns think to be a rough equivalent to the Roman Catholicism of Luther's day. In Paul's discussion, "salvation by works" meant forcing gentiles to adopt Judaism as a prerequisite to entering the church as Christians. In our day (since Luther), "salvation by works" means works-of-merit by which one tries to earn his own salvation. The point is, the new perspective is based on the awareness that Paul's issues were not at all the same as Luther's. The gentile audience of his letters would have been at least as befuddled by a Lutheran caricature of Judaism as they would have been by the theological particularities of Pharisees, Sadducees, Zealots, Essenes, and other first century sects. Neither of these, however, is the issue which they faced and which Paul addressed. Hope this helps, John Hi Justin,
Paul’s gentile Christians were being beguiled by judaizing interlopers. Paul responded by insisting his work and preaching consonant with the Cross, and by insisting with at least equal force that the judaizing agitators were not.

The issue is not first century Judaism, and the intricacies to be found between its factions. The issue is between Judaism, as it was presented by the Judaizers, and the “Judaism” many moderns think to be a rough equivalent to the Roman Catholicism of Luther’s day. In Paul’s discussion, “salvation by works” meant forcing gentiles to adopt Judaism as a prerequisite to entering the church as Christians. In our day (since Luther), “salvation by works” means works-of-merit by which one tries to earn his own salvation.

The point is, the new perspective is based on the awareness that Paul’s issues were not at all the same as Luther’s. The gentile audience of his letters would have been at least as befuddled by a Lutheran caricature of Judaism as they would have been by the theological particularities of Pharisees, Sadducees, Zealots, Essenes, and other first century sects. Neither of these, however, is the issue which they faced and which Paul addressed.

Hope this helps,
John

]]> By: Justin Locke http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-62 Justin Locke Tue, 01 Feb 2011 15:20:37 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-62 Does anybody think it is slightly ironic that this perspective is based on first century Judaism whenever Romans and Galatians were written to Gentiles. They would not have understood the intricacies of first century Judaism so the terms Paul used with them would have been for a Gentile audience. Does anybody think it is slightly ironic that this perspective is based on first century Judaism whenever Romans and Galatians were written to Gentiles. They would not have understood the intricacies of first century Judaism so the terms Paul used with them would have been for a Gentile audience.

]]> By: David http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-61 David Wed, 19 Jan 2011 22:39:28 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-61 "We have already argued that righteousness is not simply the imputed merit of another". Sounds as if to me that you are arguing with Scripture, especially Romans chapter 4, in regards to salvation righteousness. And if you are talking about sanctification righteousness Romans 8 addresses that: For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh,so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. Notice please it is "fulfilled in us" not by us. “We have already argued that righteousness is not simply the imputed merit of another”.

Sounds as if to me that you are arguing with Scripture, especially Romans chapter 4, in regards to salvation righteousness.

And if you are talking about sanctification righteousness Romans 8 addresses that:

For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh,so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Notice please it is “fulfilled in us” not by us.

]]> By: John http://www.thepaulpage.com/a-summary-of-the-new-perspective-on-paul/comment-page-1/#comment-60 John Mon, 03 Jan 2011 18:16:31 +0000 http://www.thepaulpage.com/?p=101#comment-60 Hi Mark, Really appreciate your summary of NPP. I am hopeful that this might open the door to ending the old conflict over the salvific role of baptism. The main objection, historically, is the unfortunate categorization of baptism as a meritorious work. The second major objection (ironically championed by J. D. G. Dunn, Baptism in the Holy Spirit) is the forced dichotomy between water-baptism and Spirit-baptism (I understand Pentecost as the true and essential BiHS, with water baptism for sin remission and reception of the HS as the consequence). Some evangelical scholarship has shown a renewed openness to this salvific role which, ironically, was quite present in the writings of the earliest reformers, Luther and Calvin. God bless your life and labors in Christ Jesus, John Hi Mark,
Really appreciate your summary of NPP. I am hopeful that this might open the door to ending the old conflict over the salvific role of baptism. The main objection, historically, is the unfortunate categorization of baptism as a meritorious work. The second major objection (ironically championed by J. D. G. Dunn, Baptism in the Holy Spirit) is the forced dichotomy between water-baptism and Spirit-baptism (I understand Pentecost as the true and essential BiHS, with water baptism for sin remission and reception of the HS as the consequence). Some evangelical scholarship has shown a renewed openness to this salvific role which, ironically, was quite present in the writings of the earliest reformers, Luther and Calvin.
God bless your life and labors in Christ Jesus,
John

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